How to convert Canon 5dmk2 footage from 30p to 24p

30
May
2009
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A tutorial using Final Cut Studio 2 on how to convert footage shot in 30p to perfect 24p…Used in the short Sofia’s People http://philipbloom.co.uk/films/35mm-films/sofias-people-canon-5d-mk2/ Thanks to Denver Riddle for his original workflow post on cinema5d.com

If you have any other workflow solutions which work as well or better please share!

I don’t have any workflow ideas for non final cut I am afraid. I am sure someone can point you in the right direction.

There are many quicker ways of converting footage to 24p but this by far and away the most impressive for the best looking end results. 

Alter these settings to 25p if you want PAL, but for NTSC keep at 23.98. If you are lucky enough to just want film out then alter to dead on 24p. Makes your head spin all this!

Here is the video tutorial below. Please do check out the resulting new 24p version of “Sofia’s People” here.

This really is the most impressive results I have had from converting the footage, it took it’s time to do but I believe the effort is worth it! This is not for complete novices, you need to understand what each piece of software does to really understand. 

Here is the original post from Denver Riddle:

1. Cut video in 30 fps timeline

2. Create copy of finished edit so you’ll have two clips, one to convert to 24p and one to preserve audio.

2. Open Cinema Tool (part of Final Cut Studio), File, “Open Clip”, choose “Conform”, specify “23.98″ to conform to.

Explanation: This keeps the same number of frames in the clip, it only changes the timebase from 30fps to 24fps, essentially creates overcranked footage by 6 frames, (desirable on some shots). As a result this makes the clip longer and slows the audio down which is undesirable where audio is important. At this point you’ve already created a copy of the original clip therefore preserving the original audio which we’ll relink later in Final Cut.

3. Now open the inspector window so we can do some tweaking. Under “Frame Controls” tab, click the button to the right of “Frame Controls:” to enable this feature. Once enabled, select “On” for “Frame Controls:” Underneath the “Retiming Control” section is where we’ll make changes. For “Set Duration to:” click the radio button where it will allow us to put in a duration. NOW THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART, OPEN THE COPY OF THE CLIP WE CREATED THAT STILL HAS THE 30 FPS TIMEBASE AND PUT IT INTO THE FINAL CUT PRO TIMELINE, DELETE THE VIDEO TRACK AND ENSURE THE TIMEBASE OF THE SEQUENCE IS SET TO 23.98, GO TO THE END OF THE AUDIO AND READ THE TIMECODE, THIS WAY WE’RE ENSURING THAT WE’RE RETIMING (SPEEDING BACK UP) THE CLIP SO IT WILL MATCH THE ORIGINAL AUDIO. This number is the timecode you’ll put into the duration field, (example01:08:01:06) then depending on how well you want the footage to look also taking into consideration the time it will require to compress it choose the desired quality under “Rate Conversion:”. I choose, “Best (High quality motion compesnation)” to get superb results, however this increases the compression time.

Important: Make sure that no matter which codec you use that it remains as a 23.98 fps timebase.

4. Now take the treated clip into Final Cut, we’ve already set up the sequence from step 3. Add the clip to video track 1, relink and presto!

 

 

I’ve extensively tested this and find it to be the best way to convert 30p to 24p for the time being, or atleast until and hopefully Canon comes up with a firmware to address the issue.

 
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Comments

  1. Gert says:

    Hi Philip,

    I’m wondering why you select 23.98 frames/sec in stead of 24 frames?

    Thanks to Denver and you to post this very useful knowledge. I’m considering to translate it in to the Dutch language. (and mention both of you in that version, if that’s no problem with you).

    I’m looking forward for much more! THANKS!

    Gert

    1. pbloom says:

      it’s all down to the complicated mess of whether its for film or tv. It’s explained well here: http://www.highdef.com/library/faq.htm

  2. Jason Cypret says:

    Great tutorial. How would you handle this if you had mixed footage (24p & 30p)? Would you preform this conversion before you start editing? Thanks again for the great site and informative posts!

    1. pbloom says:

      that’s a tough one! mixing frame rates is always a nightmare…

  3. Phil I was watching your tutorial and as you were about to show us Compressor settings it stopped, thought I would let you know.

    1. pbloom says:

      just checked, looks like it is some XR issue. Replaced it with vimeo version

  4. kubalsky says:

    have you heard of any software or process that can turn 30p into 60p for slow motion? Something that could build frames between the existing 30. That would be great too.

  5. [...] this blog post, he’s sharing his tips on how to convert from 30fps to 24fps… he’s created this video to go with the blog [...]

  6. Felipe Salum says:

    Hi Philip.

    Do you have an article in how to convert the 5D original video from H.264 to Apple Pro Res ?

    I have read some articles saying that Compressor isn’t a good option for this due some color loss.

    Thanks,
    Felipe

    1. pbloom says:

      I use mpeg streamclip. It’s a free piece of software and very easy to use. If I get a chance I will write a brief article about it

      1. Felipe Salum says:

        Cool, I’m using it too. Just having difficult to know if I’m choosing the best options to export. If you write an article or just post a step-by-step would be awesome :P

  7. Jeffrey Wood says:

    Hi Philip, I have a mess and don’t know where to turn. I’ve shot weddings on Ex1 720p50 and 5d as b camera. All was fine till I formatted it to pal dvd. How can I mix 50p with 30p and output to 25p? PLease please help, I’m stupid!

  8. Jeff Smith says:

    Phillip,

    You show a good way to get 30p to 23.98 (or24), but just dropping that result in a FCP 29.97 timeline doesn’t give you smooth motion – FCP just repeates every 4th frame – no 3-2 pulldown is happening. You’re better off using your 23.98 result in a 23.98 sequence and forget about 30fps.

    1. pbloom says:

      Hi Jeff

      Am confused…When am I using my 23.98 result in a 30fps sequence?

      Phil

  9. Filippo Chiesa says:

    Hi Philip,

    thanks for your review.
    For all Premiere Pro CS3 or CS4 users, I would like to explain how to convert Canon EOS 5D Mark II video footage to 25p files or any other rate.
    I personally use CineForm intermediate software.
    It converts most camera or file-based source formats into 10-bit CineForm Intermediate HD files while also performing valuable tasks such as telecine removal, deinterlacing, spatial resampling, and much more. Enables true 24p editing workflows from most HD sources.
    CineForm is not too much cheap, but, in my opinion, it offers the industry’s highest quality.
    Thanks!

    Ciao,
    Filippo

  10. Jeff Lee says:

    Hi Philip,

    just wondering if the clips have sync sounds, will it still be synced in this workflow?

    1. pbloom says:

      absolutely, that’s why you get the timing exactly from the timeline

  11. ReaL J says:

    Hello Philip!

    Thank you for your work

    I bought 5dmk2 yesterday.!

    Because of your brisket video!!!

    Thank you!!^^.

    I will study on this workflow
    30P-24P^^

    but anyway
    I dont know hou to convert from 5dmk2
    to final cut!

    do you have any work flow video?^^

    Thank you!^^.

  12. Nick says:

    I have followed this method exactly and I keep getting a “strobe” effect on any movement. Has anyone had this problem? Is there something I am doing wrong.

    I am using the highest quality setting on compressor.

  13. GhostDog says:

    did some tests with my Panasonic TZ7 /SZ3 and tried your method. Am still not sure of what that little cam is actually recording but I think its an interlaced signal wrapped in a 30p format.
    Maybe its because of this that your method doesnt work at all (very visible ghosting). Had perfect results instead with the following method:

    throw the footage in compressor, apply a Prores HQ preset (progressive), go to video, put in framerate 23.976, then go to frame controls and under “retime control” change deinterlace options to “reverse telecine”.

    very quick and perfect results.

    Just wanted to share, b/c I think there are a few cameras out there that record 30p fps at first look but are actually coming in as 60i from the sensor. Hope I got everything right and please excuse my crappy english :)

    1. pbloom says:

      absolutely. You are doing something called pulldown, which is totally different. This is for 5dmk2 only. it’s not perfect, am currently testing new options….

  14. Nick says:

    Does anyone get a ghosting or strobing effect when using this process?

  15. Severin says:

    Hi Philip!

    Have you found a better way yet?

    Have you tried Twixtor?

    What happens when you convert it directly to 24p in Mpeg Streamclip when converting from h.264 to pro res? I tried it and it’s still very fast. It looks good on first sight but maybe it’s not the best way …

    Thanks for all the great input!

  16. Hey Philip
    I can’t really understand why do you convert it to 24p in a first place? What’s wrong with the 30p?…except you want a slow motion of course?
    And why not 24 but 23, something?

    May be it’s obviouse, but not to me:)Sorry

    1. pbloom says:

      24p is the frame rate of film and is key to creating the film look.

  17. Hi Philip,

    Thanks for your valued contribution on the video side of the 5D Mark II. I was introduced to the 5D picture quality a little over a week ago and was so impressed I have crossed over from a Z1 to a 5D mark II and am fully embracing the steep learning curve!
    The Z1 is now on eBay!!

    Many thanks!

    SD.

    1. Murphatron says:

      Welcome to the revolution and goodbye RED.

      1. pbloom says:

        i wouldn’t discount RED just yet…

  18. Joey says:

    Thanks for this workflow, and the video tutorial was a nice touch. The workflow looks great on mostly static shots, but I’ve found that when applying to shots with pans or any movement, there’s an effect that is introduced, perhaps the strobing effect that Nick mentioned above (to me, it looks sort of like the Plastic Wrap Photoshop effect, but only on specific parts of the frame). I tested changing the Rate Conversion quality to “Good (Frame Blending)” and that artifacting no longer appears. It’s also 15x faster in Compressor on my G5, so, if you don’t mind frame blending, this could be a (much faster/better) solution. I did test both Rate Conversion qualities, both on my G5 tower and my Intel Macbook, with the same results (though I didn’t benchmark the Macbook).

    1. pbloom says:

      yes i have a new version of tutorial that I showed at UKFCPUG last week that I need to put online soon that shows the difference and why sometimes you should have frame blending on or off…

  19. [...] Bookmarked a link on Delicious. Philip Bloom » Blog Archive » How to convert Canon 5dmk2 footage from 30p to 24p [...]

  20. [...] the “film look” of 24fps, this is the method I would use. It’s based on Bloom’s blog post (watch his tutorial video). Here are the steps if you are cutting with Final Cut [...]

  21. instantcook says:

    Hi,
    I tried the same workflow with twixtor, inside After Effects.
    But I get some problem.
    On quick movement, I get distortion on the interpolated frame.
    P. Bloom, can you test you method on the same shot as me ?
    (my compressor is bugged, no way to test it myself).
    Here is the link to the footage I used : (i will post it in a second comment tonight)

    And you’re speaking about some other test you maid : the results ? Do you find a better workflow ?

    Eric.

  22. [...] Philip Bloom FCP 30p to 24/25p – not one I use, twixtor/shake make more sense to me [...]

  23. harriet says:

    Hello,

    I wonder if you can help me, im pretty desparate :)

    I followed you workflow and have problems with some clips that I have slowed down- They play perfectly in the sequence but when exported it is a completely different part of the original clip.

    Any help would be greatly apprieciated x

  24. Graeme Becl says:

    Hi,
    I finally found a great way to get a conversion from 30p to 25i. Its on Adobe Premiere CS4 but might work on FC, please let me know. Tried 24 briefly, not as good, but didnt go much further because 25i/p works so well. I/P as in 2 progresive frames followed by 2 interlaced. Sound is lip sync. (over 1 hour in a dual shoot with a Sony 25i camera.)

    Must put 30p Canon footage in a 60p timeline and select the clips and ‘interlace consecutive frames.’ You then dub to whatever you want in a 25i format. Good thing about it you get nice smooth motion, no frame blending! The process looks similar to a reverse 2:3 pull up from 24p to 60i.

    I fimd 30p is an ideal progressive format, I used to like the 24p or 25p film look but find the 50i or 60i too fast. The Canon converted to 25i/p looks great on TV here.

    Regards,
    Graeme Beck.

    1. pbloom says:

      Thanks for the that Graeme.

  25. [...] Bloom has had his tutorial on converting Canon 5D Mark II footage from 30 to 24fps for awhile now, but I finally had the chance to take it for a spin. He wasn’t the first [...]

  26. Hi Philip,

    Just wondering, why would I deinterlace 30p footage? Isn’t the stuff already progressive, in which case I can just tick off the interlaced option in mpeg streamclip, or keep my hands of the frame controls in compressor… This is actually not a response to the abovem but the video tutorial I found on the canon website…

    Thanks,
    Daan

  27. carl says:

    Some fantastic stuff, thanks for entertaining me hour after hour by reading your blog and tutorials.
    although i haven’t been using the canon 5d mkii(i have been following closely with drool following behind me), i have been using the sanyo vpc-hd2000ex to keep me occupied while serching for a new procam
    just thought i would share, when i have been playing with mpeg streamclip the results when just typing in the framerate and creating a .mov (prores422) have produced wonderful results with no visiable change in quality thats changing from a 60fps footage to 23.98fps. have you looked at this route? assuming you probably have, is there anything wrong with this method?

    thanks again,

    Carl

  28. Hallo everyone! GOOD NEWS!

    Canon has announced the development of a firmware update for its EOS 5D Mark II digital SLR. The updated version will enable full frame high definition (1080p) video recording at 24 and 25 frames per second.The new firmware is expected to be made available for download in the first half of 2010.

    click for more > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0910/09102003eos5dfirmware.asp

    Cheers :-)

  29. Jeff says:

    Thanks for the tutorial, Philip. Unfortunately, this workflow doesn’t work for projects that have precise audio syncing with the video. When setting the duration of the clip in Compressor, the final clips is close but never exactly what I set the duration to, so dialogue goes out of sync. I’ve tried a few times, but it never gives me consistent results, usually a few seconds off.

  30. michaelkelly says:

    Hey there, I am compressing a 13 minute piece on “Best(High quality motion compensated)”, and it is telling me 30 hours remaining. I’ve got a pretty fast macbook. Is it possible that compressor will actually do it much faster. I did one on “Good (frame blending) and it took 2 and a half hours.
    Thanks for this, and roll on 25p!

  31. imivision says:

    Well, I have a problem here. When I copy the audio from my original 30p edit sequenz to my 24p sequenz it slightly changes duration from 0:02:47:20 to 0:02:47:16. So my audio is now 4 frames to short. Any clues at what I might be doing wrong?

  32. It should have been noted in the original post that this 30p to 24p conversion only works when there is no 100% accurate sound sync needed. Forget about using this method with any project that has dialogue sync.

    I’ve spent several days trying to use Phillip’s method to convert a 23:01:22 short documentary and no matter what compression settings I use the dialogue goes out of sync after a minute or two.

    If you’re just making a project that has visuals layered on top of an audio track, and can afford several seconds of ‘slipping’ then this method works.

    Cheers,

    R

    1. pbloom says:

      it should work spot on. Have you tried the updated version linked at top of this blog?

      1. I’ve done exactly what is mentioned in your video tutorial as well as what is written. Compressor immediately changes the duration I’ve entered as soon as it starts rendering. No matter how many times I stop and start that it always changes it arbitrarily. But that doesn’t seem to be the issue because the sync is usually off by about 1-2 minutes at the end of the 20 minutes.

        Perhaps I’m not using the correct link from the top of this blog. Could you re-post it in a reply so that I make sure I’m following your lead?

        Cheers,

        Rod

  33. john paget says:

    I followed these steps, but Compressor did not produce a final file that was the exact duration I set it for. The end result was about 12 frames short of the duration I specifically asked for, and so still out of sync. Wonder what I did wrong.

  34. I accidentally recorded 60p when it was supposed to be 24p so I did a test to convert the 60p footage to 24p using mpegstreamclip and surprisingly I think it worked. Haven’t tried 30p to 24p though. Maybe it works for that too…

    Open footage in MpegStreamClip.

    Export to Quicktime

    Choose Apple DVCPRO HD 720p60 for compression (must have final cut installed for this option to show up)

    Slide quality to 100%

    Sound to Uncompressed

    Frame Rate: type 23.976 in the box (most important part)

    Frame size “HDTV 720p”

    uncheck Interlaced Scaling

    uncheck Deinterlace Video

    And hit “Make Movie”

    And voila! should be 24p now

    1. Karianne says:

      Hi Tulaga! Did mpegstream work out well? No regrets later? I tried it now, after getting clips 2-3 frames out of sync using Philip’s way. And mpegstream looks good. Where there any problems later?

  35. edwardfilms says:

    Hi Philip, Great blog, really useful posts as always.

    If I am mixing 30fps and 25fps footage from the 5dMK2, would you recommend editing a mute timeline with both in and then conforming the whole timeline to 25 fps, or cutting a 30fps timeline, corforming that to 25fps and then adding that footage to the 25fps timeline?

    Thanks in advance,

    1. pbloom says:

      mixing is hell. pick one, convert the rest to the majority is best suggestion…

  36. Patrick O'Donnell says:

    For those of you with syncing issues, make sure that you are using the length of time of the original audio track placed in the new 24p sequence you’ve made – if you use the length from the original 30p sequence, it will be out of sync.

  37. Joey Julius says:

    In compressor… the 24p conversion setting will not accept a 30p timecode…
    I.E. 04:43:29 30p from fcp translates to 04:44:05 in 24p compressor setting.
    What to do?

  38. Lenny Levy says:

    Better method with Twixtor and AE

    I just had to fix a walk n talk sequence for a documentary shot two camera with an F3 correctly set at 23.98 and an Ex-1 accidently set at 29.97. The 29.97 neededt o be convereted to 23.98.

    I tried the Compressor method here (which is actually explained in more detail on Ken Stone’s index,btw) but it left me with some unacceptable artifacting in the subjects tie.

    What worked much better was a Twixtor plug-in in Adobe After Effects.
    This was nearly seamless and the client was very happy with the results. Check out this tutorial which I followed pretty much exactly:

    http://library.creativecow.net/articles/freitag_lori/twixtor-frame-rate-con….

    Lenny Levy